What kind of primers does federal use

For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly. You should upgrade or use an alternative browser. Niles Coyote Gunny Sergeant. Full Member. Aug 13, 4, South West, MI. While searching around for some info I stumbled on to this thread and its too good not to share.

Additional Information from James Calhoon - "Primers and Pressure" Varmint Hunter Magazine, October, Hopefully this explains a bit more about, not only primers in general, but specific characteristics that can aid a reloader in choosing the optimum sparkplug. Pertinent information will be added to this section when more information becomes available.

This flame can also be manipulated to last a little longer, by adding tiny particles of other flammable material to the priming compound. These differences really can effect not just accuracy but pressure. For instance, in a very small rifle cartridge such as the. Instead of a relatively gentle, slowly accelerating push, the bullet gets cruelly hit hard.

This is why some Hornet fans use small pistol primers, with much milder brisance than small rifle primers.

Really huge rifle cases such as the biggest Weatherbys, Remington Ultra Mags, and older British African cartridges require a lot of very slow-burning powder to operate at all.

Slower-burning powders are normally more difficult to ignite, and a bigger flame of longer duration helps, especially in cooler weather. Many handloaders think the is still the hottest commercial rifle primer, but the CCI and Winchester magnum rifle primers are just as hot, if not a little hotter.

Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. Deciding which to use depends not only on the size of the case but the powder. How fast a powder burns depends not only on granule size bigger granules have more relative surface area but on exterior coatings.

Extruded powders, such as relatively small-grained or large-grained H depend mostly on granule size to control burning rate. By definition, these coatings make ball powders harder to ignite. To make the zip however, we might try Ramshot Big Game. The Ramshot ball powders burn cleaner than most ball powders, but they also require more flame. This can often result in smaller groups. Something else to remember is that competition rifle shooters often favor mild primers i.

They feel that as primer brisance gets higher, it also gets less repeatable from primer to primer. Another train of thought is that the powder is ignited a tad more gently. When this happens, the front slope of the pressure curve is less steep. Which means the bullet is pushed a tad more gently into the rifling which tends to deform it less.

Whatever the scientific reason, competitive rifle shooters seem to feel that the milder primers give both better velocity uniformity and accuracy. The same principles also applies to handgun cases. Whatever the case, often using a standard pistol primer can reduce group size with milder or cast loads. On the other hand, magnum primers are almost always recommended for magnum loads, especially if hard-to-ignite ball powders like W, or its H twin, are used.

In fact, magnum pistol primers were developed for the large case revolver magnums like the. They seldom are needed for standard autoloader rounds or standards like the. Some powder manufacturers recommend standard pistol primers with certain of their powders even in magnum pistol loads.

This is generally true at maximum safe pressure levels. They often found that a particular propellent works fine with standard CCI primers at the maximum safe pressure. However it may not consistently ignite with lower charge weights. In those cases the use of magnum CCI primers to insure performance over the range of charge weights is recommended or perhaps a switch to a hotter standard primer such as the Winchester WLR. So as you can see, picking the right primer brisance can be very important and can give you optimum accuracy and consistent performance.

Fortunately for us there are primers of every brisance level in every category of primer, whether it be standard or magnum. You can see the importance of cup thickness when primers are considered for semiautomatic rifles that have free-floating firing pins. Handgun primers have thinner cups than rifle primers, making them easier to ignite with the typically weaker firing pin fall of handguns.

Small Pistol primer cups are. This is the reason using handgun primers in. Obviously their substitution in the high pressure. Even the same type of primers from different manufacturers can have different cup thickness. On occasion this can be handy. Some revolver trigger and action lightening jobs may result in a lighter hammer fall that results in not all the primers going off. These are supposed to whack primers with the same approximate energy as an old-fashioned 98 Mauser strike, but under some adverse conditions they can occasionally use a little help.

Federal primers can provide that help. It was intended for the. When Remington introduced their. The 41 just gives you a little more safety margin for free-floating firing pins and would be the best choice for commercial reloaders who have no control over the rifles their.

Another factor which determines the strength of a primer cup is the work hardened state of the brass used to make the primer cup.

Manufacturers specify to their brass suppliers the hardness of brass desired. It is possible that a primer manufacturer could choose a harder brass in order to keep material thickness down and reduce costs. Winchester WSR primers are somewhat thin, yet seem to be resistant to slam-fires and this is likely due to this hardness factor.

Large rifle primers all appear to have the same cup thickness of. This also affects pressure tolerance. These primers can also used in handguns such as the 9mm. Other cases that use the small rifle primer can use the above primers only if moderate loads are used.

Keep to the lower end of reloading recommendations. Hornady reports that in their research that match-grade primers performed very, very consistently from load to load as measured in their pressure tests.

CCI states that Benchrest cups and anvils are selected for exceptional uniformity. During the assembly operation, the operator who meters the primer mix into the cups or "charger" is chosen from the most experienced workers with an outstanding record of consistency.

The BR line runs at a little slower pace to provide time for extra inspection. Therefore proper storage is necessary. We have seen primer shortages and therefore runs on primers by people stocking up for the future. What would be the use of having 20k primers if you don't store them properly and they deteriorate? Heat dries out the priming compound making it brittle and subject to disintegration during the seating process, causing a misfire.

Further, the primer can still detonate if you try to disassemble misfired rounds and punch out the "bad" primer.

That is one reason that de-priming "live" primers is discouraged. High humidity can cause the priming compound to be too wet to detonate properly as well. Therefore you should take pains to store primers in a cool, dry place. No garages, attics, sheds, or damp basements. Desiccant in the larger container that holds your primer boxes is probably a good idea if it is humid where you live.

Metal ammo cans are popular for storing various items like ammo and brass among reloaders. However they should not be used to store your primers in or your powder as well. If anything sets off those primers or lights off the powder , the metal can just adds shrapnel. Of course you shouldn't store primers and powder together for obvious reason.

Last edited: Apr 4, Reactions: buggz , Caper , acudaowner and 4 others. Good for. Federal - Mil-Spec cup thickness according to Federal - okay for 5.

Federal M - same as the but the match version. Magtech PR-SR -. Cup thickness is a bit thinner at. Most say they are good to go for the AR15 despite that, probably because of the hardness of the cup. Some feel they are less resistant to higher pressures.

With this primer there is more 'distance' between the tip of the anvil and the bottom of the cup than with other CCI SR primers.

Same primer mix as CCI Hornady, Handloads. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics. CCI BR2 - same as the but the match version. Do not use in semi-automatics. Federal M - match version of the above primer. Russian primers use a different sinoxide compound closer to the European type , which, in my testing, consistently delivers better extreme spreads over Federal Both primers use the same cup metal and share the same cup thickness.

Both primers use the same primer compound formula and same amount of primer compound. They can be used interchangeably. Reactions: buggz , billym44 , Scoutabout and 10 others. Some rifles are much more susceptible to slam-fires than others. Therefore, there is more 'forgiveness' built in to them as to primer selection.

Another factor is rifle condition, parts tolerances, and cleanliness. A clean in-spec rifle is much more tolerant than one that isn't. This frees up your primer and ammunition choices. The SPEER reloading manual is an excellent source of expert advice and states the following: A slam-fire is the discharging of a cartridge in a firearm by the closing of the bolt without a pull of the trigger.

In most cases this is a phenomenon associated with military-style semi-automatic rifles and handloaded ammunition. The slam-fire can be caused by a high primer or by a heavy, unsprung firing pin. High primers contribute to slam-fires because the closing bolt drives the high primer cup against the anvil. All handloads must be checked for high primers; this caution is even more important when shooting military-style semi-auto rifles. Slam-fires have been reported even when primers were properly seated.

Many semi-auto service rifles have no firing pin spring and the firing pin itself is quite heavy. The inertia of the firing pin may cause it to snap forward as the bolt stops, firing the cartridge. If the bolt is not yet fully locked, the result can be a ruptured case with the potential for gun damage and injury to the shooter.

Military primers are less sensitive than commercial primers to minimize this hazard. Federal pistol primers are more sensitive than the competition. Joe My understanding is that Federal changed to it's current wide space packaging after a delivery driver managed to set off a case of primers by dropping another package on top, crushing the primers. I am mostly a rifle target shooter and primer sensitivity is an often discussed topic.

Semi auto's like the M1, M1A and AR have a floating firing pin that "taps" the primer everytime the action strips and chambers a round. For this reason it is said by many actually most not to use Federal primers in these type rifles due to an increased risk of slam fire.

So yes, I believe that Federal primers are easier to set off than other brands. By the same argument the CCI mil spec primers 34 and 41 are the least sensitive. I haven't shot a match in a long time but, back in the day, I remember every gunsmith that built a PPC gun told the customeer the gun was "set up" for Federal primers. This allowed them to give the lightest DA trigger with the most reliability.

Primer purchase for me has always been dictated by what was on the shelf. I will pick federal first and then Winchester.

I have used CCI and constantly seemed to have Trouble with size on the darn things. I do have some CCI's in my small stash of primers but they are regulated to Back up Status behind the corrosive military ptrimers I got in trade a couple of years ago!

The hardest primer I have ever fired have been the remington's! It has nothing to do with dropped cartridges or "pre-stressed" compound. The chemical formula Federal uses is more sensitive to begin with. The basic chemical so called because its pH value is more base than acid is simply easier to initiate than the common more acidic formula. The shipping containers are designed so that if one primer does go off for any reason, the ones around it will not also detonate.

One way to do that is to separate the primers a bit. That's what Federal does. If they all touched or nearly touched - as CCI, Rem, WW and other primers with the "common" formula are packaged - the greater sensitivity of the Federal primers would lead to mass detonation.

As happened in that shipping incident and at least once in Lee Auto-Prime tools. It's that ahem basic. Forward in time, to the present I have a couple of revolvers that need the standard weight mainspring re-installed.

Federal primers have been unavailable around here for a while and a couple of my guns only work single action with the harder primers. I've been told that the current production CCI primers are not as hard as the ones from twenty years ago, but they are still harder than Federals. That's a classic example of a harder or thick primer cup difference. Has nothing to do with sensitivity. It has a floating firing pin like an SKS. In fact the action is very much like an SKS except it's a gas impingement system instead of gas piston.

I can make the rifle full auto with large piston primers!!! I have not got it to slam fire with various brand of large rifle primers. I'll do a test with it and the AR 15 when I get some Federal large rifle and small rifle primers. It's BOTH cup toughness and compound sensitivity. Those two factors are either compensating or additive in a given primer.

That's how Federal primers are made. The latter is how those "mil-spec" CCI primers are made. Neither is good or bad; they're just designed for different uses. I can guarntee you that my tuned Blackhawk knows the difference between CCI's and anything else I use Federals when I can get them,Reminton's seem to work fine,3rd choice is Winchester.

IT's not a self defense gun,btw,it's a cas gun,so it doesn't 'have' to be percent reliable,btw. Gentlemen, I was working on my lawn tractor this evening and I got a late phone call from Federal. I had called them earlier with some primer questions.

I got a call back, like I said, from a primer tech first name Gary. I gave him the general run down of the forum post here and here's what he said. He said first and foremost primers have a sensitivity specification they must meet set by SAAMI, same organization that sets cartridge specs. He said that all primers must fall in that specification and he assured me that if they did not they not only didn't get shipped, they were destroyed.

With that said he said he sincerely doubts that any sensitivity could be distinguished between primer brands. He said Federal does use a different primer compound from the other brands, isn't the lead one mentioned above, and is no more sensitive then others. One interesting thing he said, that I asked, was the government hasn't been on them one iota about cleaning up pollutants from primers, although they do have a clean shooting primer intended for indoor shooting.

I asked if he knew Allen Jones that writes for Shooting Times and he said very well. He said he's one sharp cookie and has been in this business about as long as anyone and you could take his primer notes to the bank. Some of the primer information I stated was picked up from Mr. One of them was that you can't write a book on various brand primer performance because they change to often and to fast.

Final note was on the Federal primer packaging. That was mandated from the DOT, nothing to do with sensitivity. He did say they all wonder when Remington was going to catch up with packaging. He said if Federal primers were so sensitive, why does Federal use the same primers in loading their ammunition that is specifically aimed at semi-auto rifles.

Some of that is a bit different from other information I have - also directly from federal, mind you - but mine isn't quite as fresh as yours. While all primers fall within the sensitivity range specified by SAAMI, I'll go with the field experiences of many, many people and opine that Federals are much closer to the "more sensitive" end of that range than some other primers.

And the shipping requirements are indeed set by DOT, but to pass the DOT-described tests, more sensitive primers would have to be packaged farther apart than less sensitive ones. Federals are packaged the farthest apart of any I've seen. So that also contributes to the idea that they are indeed a bit more "touchy. But there are several ways to interpret a "fact" without contradicting it. Gary did say Federal primers could be a wee bit more sensitive then other brands, depending where the other brand set their specs.

Here's what I think. I think Federal may be a wee bit more sensitive and coupled with a softer cup To prove it is by far more sensitive would require testing equipment that test the primer cake compound separate from the cup and anvil.